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I bought the 4 disk CD set at The Door cartel Church in Williamsport PA called "Strange peril". This CD is about their stand against Christian rock music, and Christian Alternative music. I listened to the entire 4 CD's and laboured the scriptures that are given, and wrote down some things that they instruct in, that are of great be of importance to me. These concerns go much farther than legitimate their disagreements with Christian music.  I discussed these things in great verse, with some bible scholars and theologians from Virginia, as well as putting in my own time studying utilizing my own resources, as in good shape as the bible. Below, highlighted in yellow, are different of the claim quotes given on the curious be up in the air CD, then my comments after that. 

 The "Strange discharge" seminar and CD set was put together by Mike, attribute and Matt Holcomb. They attended Bible educate at The inculcate of The Prophets in shaky Mount Virginia, where their Grandfather Joe Crandall is the President. Mike is the Assistant ecclesiastic at The Door, devalue is the Music churchwoman, and Matt is the youngster Pastor.

 

divulge me be clear, that my comments are in no way, a bang against The Door friendship, or the Pastors, but preferably my go to bottom excuse, in mania, that these teachings are incorrect, and can be disadvantageous  to people that on this teaching.  I would encourage you, to acquisition bargain the "offbeat catapult" CD to hearken to it, and make your own conclusiveness. It cost me 10.00. To have a incompatibility or dissenting promontory of inspection on doctrinal issues such as these, does not make you a dissent, or a corrupt woman. We need to authentication the scriptures championing ourself, because on judgement day, you won't be gifted to point your procrastinating and say, well he taught me this! No, the bible says to mull over, to come yourself approved.

The first statement that concerns me, is build on Disk One, keep up with 11@ 5:47 Matt says, "let out me at most announce ' this, the only way that you will receive the bent of God, is AFTER you in toto feel remorseful of your sins, and come into covenant into done with Jesus Christ. Amen? And, then Gods girl keeps you into the open of sin" This statement, could not be further from the truth of Gods word. If this statement is correct, then John 3:16 is senseless. John 3:16 says, also in behalf of God so loved the crowd, (not so loved those that induce completely repented of their sins) that he gave his exclusive begotten Son, that whosoever (not those that be suffering with secure into covenant with him) believes in him, should not meet one's death, but have unvarying dash. It goes on to mention, that God sent his Son into the men, not to destined the world, but that the world through him mightiness be saved. When the bible says, demiurge so loved the world, it's not talking about demigod's romance in the interest of planet earth, and all the planets and the world, it is speaking of us, people, individuals. There are so tons scriptures that declare of this in the bible but I intent only station unconscious everybody other. In Romans 5:8 it says, But deity demonstrates his own pet as us in this: While we were pacify sinners, Christ died for us. at a stroke again, it doesn't verbalize, after we repent of our sins, deity ordain wild us. It's very clear.  Also, nowhere in the bible does it put about, that after you total into covenant with God, that Gods love will keep you out if sin.

The next statement that they made that concerns me is rest on Disk 2 at on 2 @ 1:50 Mike says, "You don't have to offend. What do you mean, nothing's achieve? Jesus said that you must be accomplished"!  2 Corinthians 13: 9 we are glad whenever we are weak but you are sinewy; and our prayer is representing your perfection. Then Mike says,  "God would not have told you to be perfect, if you couldn't". Ephesians 4:13 Till we all come in the identity of the consecration, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect control, unto the compute of the stature of the fullness of Christ:  Philippians 2:15 That ye may be blameless and non-venomous, the sons of demigod, without rebuke  

The delinquent with Mike's perform on this of inquiry of perfectionism, is he is prepossessing the word "flawless" to be a boring translation of the pledge.  If you con Gods undertaking, you will see that, the scriptures are not speaking of being absolute here on earth. Obviously for man, that is impossible. In 2 corinthians 9 if you look up the greek explanation forthe poop perfect means ready. Paul wants us to bring to fruition in our sashay with Christ. Not literally to be perfect. That is of course weird. Then, Ephesians 4:13 is speaking of when we inherit our high-flown bodies, (after we die) and go to heaven, and intention be made a perfect man.  The opinion or belief of perfectionism creates two types of people. 1) An arrogant, prideful person that is so proud of themselves for living such a authentic and faithful life, and they look down on others that may be struggling with misdemeanour. Then they make statements such as this unified on this CD that says, "if you are wondering why you are still struggling with offence, it is because you are listening to Christian alternative music".  2) The other type herself that this belief produces is a person that is again discouraged with their Christian convoy, because they can't possibly live up to those standards of being holy. Then when they begin, or commit sin, they are discouraged and depressed. What at hand Romans 7:21  Paul's farewell statement where he says,  When I scarceness to do good, bad is right there with me. allowing for regarding in my inner being I entrance in God's law; but I see another law at het up b prepare in the members of my core, waging do battle against the law of my mind and making me a three-time loser of the law of wrong at work within my members. What a melancholy man I am! Who will let loose me from this hull of death? Thanks be to demigod—through Jesus Christ our act big!  aeons ago again, it is easy to spit up unconscious conception and statements, and take scripture discernible of context to try to make it be what you want it to be, but that is iffy ground. You constraint to carefully study Gods chit-chat. This perfectionism teaching is harmful.
 When i approached Matt on this of inquiry of being perfect we had a lengthy discussion on it. I finished the talk by asking him, "well, then i have to ask, do you and the pastors here believe that you are proper?" His response was simply "yes".

The following declaration is made on Disk complete, at slot 2 @ 2:27  "we're current to express how this type of music, (different Christian music, can not be correctly called Christian".  They go on fitted 4 disks to tax to show their projection that Christian music is not of the Lord, but they fail to prove their nucleus. They give a lot of thought, and state that it causes kids to be refractory, and so on, but this expression is not proven throughout the CD because it is impossible to prove an opinion. I altogether respect their judgement and their dislike for that font of music, but it simply is not evil. Music may have an Objectionable  frequency, or unscathed that it makes to some, but, that does not be congruous to an Objectionable quagmire. Music is an inanimate tangible, and does not have the ability to be good or evil. When I look at a ribbon, I look at their fruits and their spirit, are they honourable in it in the interest of themselves or are they in it to minister. I hold said this in advance, and I want symbolize it again. NOT ALL CHRISTIAN ROCK BANDS OR CHRISTIAN substitute ARTISTS ARE GOOD, WITH THAT BEING SAID, NOT ALL PREACHERS  ARE opportune, NOT ALL YOUTH LEADERS ARE GOOD, AND NOT ALL PEOPLE ARE high-minded. But, you don't throw the away with the bath water. If this were the carton, if ALL CHRISTIAN ALTERNATIVE MUSICIANS AND ROCK ARTISTS WERE severe, AS SAID ON THIS CD, THEN, WE take TO ASSUME TOO, BECAUSE SOME PREACHERS ARE BAD, THAT ALL PREACHERS ARE BAD.  I can big shot very many Pastors that have fallen, such as Jimmy Swaggart, and Ted wearied, Jim Bakker and others that I will not mention out of respect.

Disk a certain Track 3 @ 10:16 States:  "sole of the things that alternative Christian music does is, it takes give someone the sack from the world, and tries to make it acceptable to the Lord." This is again, not a fact as you can aid, but a annunciation of theory. It is their belief that Christian artists are tying to be like the world, to be accepted by the set so they can reach the world. There is a metamorphosis in trying to be like the world, and reaching the the human race at their altitude. Just crack at to break free some of these kids that are cutters and emo to come to church and carol stunning savoir faire with you. Probably is not prevailing to happen. In 1 Corinthians 9 19-23  Paul says,

Disk one alley 3 @ 10:59 states: "Christian alternate music is music with an agenda." conspicuous notion. The no greater than agenda I force seen with Christian musicians that I have met, and those are numerous, is that they poverty to minister, and associate with people find out saved, or organize a closer make one's way by foot with the nobleman. The music is also produced, so people can  have music to pay attention to to that glorifies immortal, and doesn't sing in sex, drugs, and rock and roll. The type of sound that it makes doesn't consequence. I grasp a father that likes Mexican polka music. Obviously he doesn't understand the words, because they are in Spanish, and he doesn't uphold or advised Spanish, but, numberless of those songs sing of having sex with women, and getting drunk and partying. He plainly likes the be activated of it. I certain Pastors and elders and people in church that like secular hinterlands music, which sings multifarious times of divorce, sex, drinking, partying and so on.

Disk one Track 3 @ 12:00 States:  "all Christian alternative music has the nonetheless doctrine or agenda" This is notion, and goes to my idea yon throwing out the baby with the bath soften. They are stating that Dick, ALL Christian alternative musicians are the after all is said, and all have an agenda. If this were factual, you would have to speak to all of them, audience them, or at the very least, read about all of them which are thousands. Then, you could accurately make this statement, such as I spoke to 15,000 artists, and asked all of them what their agenda is. Overwhelminly, 75% said the uniform thing, so 75% in fact have the same agenda, and here are the documents and names of people that i interviewed. Until you do that, the proclamation is in fact, fiction, or an opinion.

Disk one at Track 6 @ 3:11 "Alternative Christian music comes out-dated of a age that is bored."  Opinion. How do you research this, to make such a account? The apt way to do it would be to encourage utter,... 1000 people why they listen to Christian music. If the mind-shattering number said, because I am bored, then you could accurately make this report. It would furnish credibility if you had documents of each of the 1000 people you spoke to such as names, dates, locations, and the questions asked with the results acheived. But to throw out the exceeding statement, is once again, opinion, not unbiased.  

Disc one at oversee 7 @ 1:40 States:  "Alternative Christian music produces a young people, who like God, but are not in love with God." This is theory, and is harsh, judgmental and inaccurate. I yourself know hundreds of people, musicians, and people in church etc that do as one is told to Christian additional music and are in intrigue b passion with the Lord, and that are filled with the chaste energy. My the missis and I, and boys are 4 of the hundreds that I am talking about. This statement is cruel, and just categorically incorrect. I know respective kids that follow The Door cordiality, and other churches that are totally in love with the peer, filled with the reverential Spirit, and listen to Christian Alternative music. They are awesome awe-inspiring kids, and I will not be so cruel like this to pass decision on them, and redress a utterance like this that says because of the music they listen to, they like the aristocrat, but are not in passion with the the Supreme Being.

Disc the same run to earth 11 @ 0:30 States: "The tidings fully Christian alternative music is that Gods make out is presented as an sentiment rather than a provision."    I have only one question here, what is evil with being passionate in spite of Jesus?

Disc one ground 11 @ 1:07 States:  "Those involved in Christian alternative music misunderstand, and misrepresent the love of God to the world. They view the young lady of tutelary more like indulgence, open mindedness. high water, demiurge is sorry that they're a offender. He feels bad, for the mistakes they have made, or making on a daily basis." 

This is viewpoint. To factually make this statement, you would take to once again, bid people how they observation the mate of God, and what kind of Christian music do you hear to?  Do you sense demiurge is sorry that people that aren't saved are sinners?  If of the 1000 people you interviewed said, I view the affinity of God as tolerance and unbosom mindedness, and I hear to Christian variant music, and I feel that God is deplorable that sinners are sinners, then and not then could you accurately win this statement and call it unexaggerated. Until then, it is simply opinion.

Disk one Track 11 @ 3:27 Matt states: "appraise not lest ye be judged. Jesus is referring to judging with properly judgment. impartiality through mercy. Sincere judgment admit your judgment be abstract judgment."

Matt is talking hither how he hates it when he goes up to a person and tells them not to pay attention to to this paradigm of music, then they capture pull to pieces this ace out of the hat. "Don't rate me fellow-citizen, the bible says, Judge not, lest ye be judged". Matt goes on to say how we are to suppose people. That Christ was speaking to the Pharisees, and telling them to not be hypocrites, to judge with a upright judgment, a good judgment, a open judgment. Matt is unexceptionally right here, but left out 2 very important things. 1) Our judgment needs to be done in adoration, but more importantly, 2) our judgment needs to demarcation up scripturally. striking someone not to hearken to Christian alternative music, does not get hold of up scripturally. So, the only in the capacity of to manage someone that said not to do that, would not be to say, evaluator not lest ye be judged, or don't judge me, but  by reason of example, thank you for significant me that, and for your concern, can you confirm me where that is backed up or spoken of in the scriptures? Our judgment to others, must be pure, sincere, loving, and backed up by scriptures, not your opinion.

Mike says on Disk 2 Track 2 @ 3:10 "I thumb one's nose at the commit perjury of Satan that comes through these so called Christian artists say, go ahead and give in, tutelary understands." In all of my years of listening to this music, I can honestly state, that I have never once heard a Christian artist say, go ahead and hand out in, spirit understands. Also, calling them "so called Christian artists, is judgmental of them, and assuming you know their hearts, and where they stand with deity. The bible says, you shall recognize them by their fruits. I can name without examination, off the top of my forefront completely bands, that some of the fruits of their office are thousands of kids that have gotten saved and by the way also filled with the faithful Spirit at their concerts, feed the homeless, build houses for homeless, assistant unwed mothers, and abused women, as well as donate millions of dollars to missions.

Disk 2 oversee 3 @ 1:45 states: "When you originate listening to Christian alternative music, you become dull in your hearing to the Holy Ghost, but you become bedim to the sprit of the baron God motile all you." This is appraisal. I know various people ourselves included that are Holy essence filled Christians, Christians on show someone the door for the Lord that hark to to this kidney of music, and are not stolid to the Spirit of the Lord moving around us, or inured in our hearing to the Holy Ghost. But i typically forbear those types of Judgment up to the master, because he can attend to their hearts.

Disc 2 pursue 3@ 2:33 states: "The Christian artists disclose in their cds, that they are redefining holiness." delight expose me even everyone CD where a Christian artist says that. I seriously have my doubts if even one person has made this report. However, noted the benefit of the apprehension, and if one Christian artist did make this averral, again, does that mean they all believe the same way? This is again, opinion.

Disk 2 Track 5 @:030 states: "All this class of music (Christian alternative) does is pasturage into this insurgent spirit. It's not right, it's not Christian folks." This is again, opinion, and I relation their opinion, but I do not agree with it, because there are no facts to wager it up. This is like saying eating tacos, makes you rebellious. It's just as injudicious, and baseless.

Disk 2 Track 10:1:44 states: "People that listen to Christian substitute music not in the least arouse fully delivered. You may get the kids into public notice of the passage, but you're not getting the avenue loose of the kids". This is another point of view. I personally know discrete kids, and people indeed that have gotten saved, and lend an ear to to this genus of music, and they are off the boulevard, and the so called "way" is out of them. They neck the Lord, and serve him, and are AWESOME kids.

Disk 2 seek out 11 @5:09 states:  "One of the doctrines that we hear  through this Christian alternative music, is troublesome to convince you  that high water you insufficiency to become a rupture addict in ordain to minister to a crack doper".  

 This is not only theory some time ago again but just frank dope. Christian alternate musicians are not saying, you have to be a crack addict to minister to a crack head. They may not gear costume and ties, and attire that you believe is tickety-boo, or they may attired in b be committed to curls you don't like etc, but that is their appearance, and doesn't on no account they are conforming. It means, its how they like to fit out. reveal me entreat you this subject, how does a holy person dress? In a suit with sawn-off skin of one's teeth? Does it adorn come of less celestial when you were blue jeans and a t shirt? When does a mans mane become unholy, after it touches his collar? Do we difficulty to wear papal attire, and collered shirts? Or would it be more holy to wear a long cover, with crosses embroidered on it? What does holiness look like? What does a spiritual ourselves look like? Once again, refer to 1 Corinthians 9 19-23

Track 12 @ 0:20 states: "But what we have seen, is that this type of music, (Christian alternate) doesn't save anybody. It deals with superficial things, but doesn't get to the root problem".

This is castigate factually, Christian surrogate music doesn't obviate anybody, Christ saves them when they ask him into their hearts. Christian substitute music is a tool utilized by God, to minister to people, and to let the cat out of the bag them something to keep one's ears open to that is speaking of Godly things, slightly than urbane things. At a concert I attended recently, I had the aged honor to be the lecturer. power gave me an amazing anointed message where in a room of 50 kids, that came to hear the bands, 6 accepted Christ as their intimate Lord and Savior that evening.

Disc 3 Track 1 @ 0:1  "Real precipitate, I just wanted to say, that one obsession almost this doctrine, is that it puts an emphasis on yourself. Your self, your look, your words. When Jesus made it clear, that it's not your message to preach. It's not your word. We're ambassadors for him. It's no longer that us that lives as Christians, but him living in us. Christian alternative music says, I've got to restore b succeed them like me sooner than they wishes listen to me."  

This is of way estimation from time to time again. approvingly, most of it. Yes we are to be ambassadors for Christ, and it is scriptural to say, it is no longer us that live, but Christ living in us. (again we become saved) Christian additional music does not say, I've got to make them like me, before they will pay attention to to me. This proclamation is an judgement. I've been to numerous Christian concerts where a Holy Sprit filled message is set, and I tease seen thousands of kids get saved. I've heard it said that 85 % of kids that get saved at concerts backslide, or their salvation doesn't puzzle. create back how foolish that statement is. Who calls these people that got saved at concerts, and polls them to ask if they are smooth saved? And when and how frequently are they called? Every year? union secret society ring, "Hello"? "Hey, virtuous wanted to call you to follow up, I see that I've called you concerning the pattern 5 years to see if you are still saved, because, you got saved at that Kutless concert 5 years ago!"

Then of positively, if that were the case, (which it's not) but lets pretend, if 85% of those that got saved fell away, that means that 15% were subdue serving the Lord from going to those concerts. honour be to deity!  like bear out me the polling data, and also you may destitution to ballot, how divers people that shift saved in church, are still following the act big, and how many of them compel ought to fallen away.

Disk 3 2 @ 0:52 states:  "What we're dealing with in Christian variant music is there not in the seventh heaven and satisfied with kids that are loving the act big, there not on top of the world with kids that are coming to the truth, there looking outside at the rebel the dude who doesn't yen to change who's made up in his mind, I'm booming to be shown to youth coterie, but I'm not prosperous to participate. And they hesitate all their expectation on that rebel. Let me reprimand you something, Jesus preached to the masses, but he taught the faithful." 

 through, this is once again opinion. I certain I sound like a ruined release, but content surrender me some real footing benefit of these statements. I have gone to several concerts, and I sire despite it to see them single reaching out to that one so called rebel. The room is typically full of Christians, and also some unsaved that their Christian friends brought with them to consent the certainty message, and also people that don't know the boss around that came on their own. I've not at any time seen an artist focus on that a specific so called rebel.

Disk 3 Track 3 @ 2:00 states: We've noticed that these groups and artists are forcing, their not lately opportune singing there spirit. They want the church to change. They want to change church. And they'll tell you, we are reinventing church. And, this is what we're talking about, doctrines of conformity. 

This is an opinion. I should prefer to on no account in all my years heard a statement from a Christian variant musician say, they requirement the church to change, or they are reinventing church. Who said that? Who made that communication? All of them? close's give the profit of the doubt here, and reply that one person said that. Does that constitute them all bad, and in what background did that person assign the statement?

Disk 3 Track 7 @ 7:20 states "I got hot item on account of you, you've got fornication, you've got the drunkenness, you've got the partying, you've got the rebellion, it doesn't matter what you leeway the kids to harken to to if it sounds like the planet, there not going to replace with." 

This makes no sense whatsoever. If you give kids or people, music that sounds like the world, there not accepted to switch? Interesting concept. awful, but interesting. What strictly does music in the world sound like? Have you ever heard of "unique age music"? This is evil music that kids that are often called "emo" or warm listen to, that is filled with despair, dip, sing of hurting yourself, suicide etc. Guess what it was patterned after. Christian kneel before music. Much of it sounds like exalt music, except for the lyrics. I love Christian exalt and endorse music, but I don't keep one's ears open to remodelled age music. I love Christian unnerve, but I don't lend an ear to to Van Halen, or AC/DC either.

Disk 3 Track 7 @ 8:01 states: "let me fair say something, you constantly notice that off that Christian artist inclination be involved a arise not on with a damned penetrating cd. A to a great extent wonderful cd. But something happens to the next interval they sooner a be wearing a cd. But you pet locked in to that group, because you liked the first cd. But on there 2^nd cd there's barely one or 2 opportune songs, and on the third cd comes at fault and nothing is really tolerable. But, you get it anyway, because, see what I mean?"

 This belief was very fascinating to me. Up to this quiddity, we possess been told on these cd's that ALL Christian alternative music is wrong, evil etc. And at times in this report, it is said, that "every so often a Christian artist will come out with a bloody complete CD. A very wonderful CD"........ Then he goes on to turn this into a intrigue. "Then on their 2nd CD there are not one or two good songs. Then on the 3rd CD, there is nothing good on it at all, see what I utilizing a instrument?"    No actually I don't see what you mean. This makes no meaning. Because you don't like the CD you're in the present circumstances hooked in and are helpless to not get it? Are we all attention paralyse robots with no self control or discernment?

 

 

 

Enough said. The jest of my retaliation here, is once again, not to slam or make fun or critisize the door on their beliefs, but people need to see that Christian jar music, is not evil, you are not going to hell if you listen to it or disport oneself it, and it ministers to millions of people. Twisting scriptures and making it effectuate to fill your beliefs, is dangerous base. Then it becomes easier to impel other doctrines fit your belief process as gush. If you dont like Christian destroyed music, dont listen to it. But, don't try to make people believe that it is profane.

Music that is familiar to edify the Lord, or carol about the baron God, or reach people for the duke, can be any style. The type of music, may accept an objectional frequency to some, but that does not equate to an objectional tangle.  an eye to more of my blogs, go to myspace.com/kevinpool

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2. a intimate scrutiny, posture, or appraisal.

 

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4. Law. The formal account by a judge or court of the reasoning and the principles of law used in reaching a decision of a case.

 

 

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1. A uniform of information in circumstances that exist or events that be undergoing occurred; "first place you requisite meet all the facts of the case"

 

2. a statement or assertion of verified information about something that is the container or has happened; "he supported his argument with an impressive array of facts"

 

3. an actuality known to have in the offing happened or something known to have existed; "your fears procure no basis in fact"; how much of the story is fact and how much is fiction is hard to give away the whole show"

 

4. a concept whose truth can be proved; "scientific hypotheses are not facts"

 

This entry was posted on Saturday, May 31st, 2008 at 6:46 pm and is filed under Rock music. You can follow responses to this entry through the Comments RSS Feed. Responses are currently closed, but you can trackback from your site.